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Post by Michel on Feb 17, 2008 13:02:47 GMT -8
Just a thought but...
Recently decided to surf some diving web boards and could not believe some of the discussions going on! I mean not only about vintage diving(which of course is completely misunderstood) but diving scuba in general. People shooting each other down or coming out with completely ludicrous suggestions not to mention a lack of knowledge of some basic laws of physics(that a grade schooler would know!). Am I dreaming but is that what diving certification gets you these days: 'certified(wacko)divers'. I may be going out on a limb here but it might be safer to dive alone than dive with some of these so called experts....? And don't get me going on technical divers,with all that junk on I'm surprised not more of them drown!!! Michel A.
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Post by Broxton Carol on Feb 17, 2008 14:52:29 GMT -8
Some vintage divers live to seed negativity as they pass through life. Step over it, not in it and walk tall dude!
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Post by Michel on Feb 17, 2008 15:11:04 GMT -8
Yep... Spoken wisely as usual Chuck...
Michel.
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Post by swimjim on Feb 17, 2008 15:51:37 GMT -8
I have argued with some of the alleged tech divers on Scuba Board. Mike Ferrera in particular. This guy is clueless and a danger to those he dives with. A true Darwin award candidate. I have also been chastised for making comments about people asking questions about stuff covered in the basic scuba course. If you haven't learned it, how could you possibly be certified is my thought. But of course I must be wrong because these caring compassionette people are telling me I'm mean, have no knowlage of diving etc. Hmmmm, I got certified over 30 years ago and have more dives in a season then these guys do in a career and i don't know what I'm doing. Okay, I guess i am just a dinasor that should be left on an ice flow. Next year, I'll be diving. Will you?
Jim
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Post by Nemo on Feb 17, 2008 16:36:10 GMT -8
There's duality to just about everything in the universe, I guess; and Website Discussion Groups are no exception. Whereas they have the capacity to be of tremendous practical benefit, they do have their downside. There's been some good stuff written about "Blog Tribalism" lately. Psychologists are calling it "the new racism" and describing behavior patterns that are downright Machiavellian. When the mob mentality takes over, look out. The biggest downside is that blog tribalism is actually fragmenting and polarizing groups of people who might otherwise be united around a common interest. I'm sure we've all seen "flame wars" get pretty ugly at times, and that's a big part of the reason why, after trying to host three discussion groups of my own, I finally gave up. There's no functional discussion group at VSC, and no plans to start up again in the foreseeable future. I don't have the time to monitor that kind of thing: too busy working and building stuff. And that's also part of the reason why I don't spend a lot of time on WDG's any more: mostly just occasionally visit ones that seem fairly cool, and then usually to get or give information. Only rarely do I make a joke or socialize in WDG's any more. I try to keep it straight and informative, and stay out of the rest of that stuff. Michel, and others, all I can say is, "It's an imperfect world, and WDG's are part of it." Better yet, I'll quote John Mayall from the song, California: "Some people might treat you ugly. Some treat you beautiful, too. That's the way life is all over, so look for the good things for you." And as the old proverb says: "He who argues with a fool, is a fool." What I'm saying here is that there are people out there who use the Internet and WDG's for all kinds of purposes. When you encounter a troublemaker, it's best to just ignore him. VBR, Pat
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Post by duckbill on Feb 18, 2008 1:31:38 GMT -8
Psychologists are calling it "the new racism" and describing behavior patterns that are downright Machiavellian. When the mob mentality takes over, look out. The biggest downside is that blog tribalism is actually fragmenting and polarizing groups of people who might otherwise be united around a common interest. Emphasize: When the mob mentality takes over, look out. Man, you've got that right! Sad when he rears his UGLY head. When you encounter a troublemaker, it's best to just ignore him. True. Usually that is the best course of action. However, it is human nature to stand up for what you believe is right and just, especially when you see others being hurt. But then, you usually end up getting hurt for trying to help. Been there, done that, now I'm a happy camper!
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Post by nemrod on Feb 18, 2008 21:01:53 GMT -8
Well, I am not naming names but there are a few guys on scaryboard that if I ever meet them in person I might just smack them in the head--if I were a caveman-- but ignoring them is a better approach. I also have some friends on that board, I get dozens and dozens of PMs on that board, most people are afraid to confront the dufuses because the chief dufus is the head guy and his side kick --oh--well--I am not going to mention names. In any case, take it for what it is, many very good people and some misguided people and some who are not very nice, kinda like the human race.
Nem
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JohnA
Pro Diver
Posts: 134
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Post by JohnA on Feb 19, 2008 5:26:29 GMT -8
its tame now, anyone out there remember the old techdiver and caver boards?
John
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Post by shackle on Feb 19, 2008 11:41:26 GMT -8
" I refuse to belong to any group that would have someone like me as a member."
Groucho Marx
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Post by Nemo on Feb 19, 2008 14:07:08 GMT -8
" I refuse to belong to any group that would have someone like me as a member." Groucho Marx
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Post by Nemo on Feb 19, 2008 14:51:00 GMT -8
Nemrod said: "most people are afraid to confront the dufuses because the chief dufus is the head guy and his side kick --oh--well--I am not going to mention names."Precisely what the psychologists describing blog tribalism are talking about. A pecking order of "Chiefs and Indians" forms and becomes powerful within the group. Sometimes, it seems to go to their heads, as they feel they have the right to be downright rude and condescending to others. Challenge them in any way (like point out where they are wrong about something) and you can expect to be attacked. People will support you offline, but they mostly won't risk their standing in the group by challenging the status quo. Nemrod also said, " In any case, take it for what it is, many very good people and some misguided people and some who are not very nice, kinda like the human race."And that's exactly right. The internet is a relatively new social phenomenon, and it's going through some changes. I know it can really grind your jaws. I've been on boards dealing with potentially dangerous things like homebuilt subs, where I've seen people with no actual experience posting bogus technical info that could potentially kill somebody. When I've pointed that out, suddenly I'm the bad guy: ganged up on and asked to leave. I eventually saw it as futile and gave up on those places. Some WDG's I've seen are more about aggrandizing the regulars than they are about advancing the genre they allegedly support. They establish their group as the center of the universe: maintain an "us versus them" posture that really does more to polarize pastime-connected people than it does to unite them. Eventually, a "mein website uber alles" mindset prevails where other websites are seen as opposing tribes, and "website warfare" ensues. " Yay Us! We're number one! The rest of those guys are out of it!" Pretty barbaric. I've seen groups like that post information that's either self-biased or degrading to others, in an effort to create their own reality online, with themselves at the center of it. Kind of reminds me of that quote attributed to the Russian revolutionary, Lenin: "A lie told long enough becomes the truth." When you care about something, it hurts to see people distorting it to their own purposes; but since there are more talkers than there are doers; and since the Internet gives the talkers a soapbox to the World; it's almost impossible to compete against. If I spent my time correcting the cyberspace blabbermouths, I wouldn't have any time left for building or diving my stuff. And therein lies the frustration. The wife of a friend of mine put it beautifully: "Arguing with people in discussion groups is like trying to reason with drunks in bars." But going back to Nem's statement: the thing I've come to remember is that most of the people in WDG's are pretty cool, and the okole-puka kine are only a few. If the majority insist on keeping things civil, hopefully the rest will come around. Meanwhile, a bit of wisdom for us all: "Lots of sidewalk and very few dog turds. Learn to avoid." ;D VBR, Pat
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Post by swimjim on Feb 19, 2008 15:51:45 GMT -8
The wife of a friend of mine put it beautifully: "Arguing with people in discussion groups is like trying to reason with drunks in bars."
Right on!
Jim
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Post by duckbill on Feb 19, 2008 17:11:05 GMT -8
.....I get dozens and dozens of PMs on that board, most people are afraid to confront the dufuses because the chief dufus is the head guy and his side kick..... Here's something I've been curious about: As owners/controllers of their web sites, aren't the "chief dufuses" able to read the PMs of their members?
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Post by kgehring on Feb 19, 2008 18:18:05 GMT -8
Yes they can.
Another great saying: You can't fix stupid!
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Post by Nemo on Feb 19, 2008 21:10:39 GMT -8
Yes they can. Another great saying: You can't fix stupid! Wrote a song. Really had to do with the whole political thing lately, but I guess it applies to stupidity everywhere. Sung to the tune of the Mickey Mouse Club theme:Whose the jerk who's spoiling things for folks like you and me? S T U P I D I D I O T Stupid idiot! Stupid idiot! You make my shake my head and wonder why.... Were you born with brain deformed, or freaked on LSD? S T U... (You're a stupid arse!) P I D (D? Your grade point average!) I D I O T....!
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