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Post by diverdon on Mar 17, 2017 11:43:03 GMT -8
One step at a time...
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Post by tomcatpc on Mar 17, 2017 20:11:19 GMT -8
As for the coloured hoses...any idea of a potential price range? If they are not too much, I'd be interested in one in Healthways Blue.
Mark
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Post by vance on May 8, 2017 12:44:10 GMT -8
Here's an interesting pic I took of three different Healthways nylon valve plungers and springs. Although it came out of one of my regs, I don't swear to the middle spring being OEM. 
So, we've got black, translucent and white plungers. The translucent one in the center is obviously longer than the other two. It appears that the spring on the left is larger in diameter. The center one has not been flattened on the ends like the other two, and the one on the right has a definite bend in it. I decided not to bore you or myself with measuring them. Yet. Phil Here I am quoting myself... But I was messing around with the plunger in one of my Scubas, since it developed a slight leak. I took the HP valve apart, and installed a different plunger. The one that was leaking was like the translucent center one above, and the replacement a white one like the one on the right. This Scuba has the machined restrictor in it. When reassembling, I noticed the whole assembly dropped deeper into the valve and didn't require as much compression to fit the snap ring back in. I also saw that my lever adjustment was way different. As I started looking into why, I noticed that the levers were floppy against the tension of the spring/plunger. Huh? Comparing the spring and original plunger to the spring and new plunger, I observed that they are quite different in length. The longer, translucent plunger holds the spring higher than the shorter, white one. This has to do with the step inside that the spring sits on. Assembly takes more compression to fit the snap ring. This changes the lever height again! I took another Scuba apart, and this one also has the machined restrictor and translucent plunger. Same thing happens when assembling, the whole thing fits lower down inside the valve body. Floppy lever, different lever adjustment. Apparently, the stamped restrictor vs the machined one (see page 5,6 for pics of the different restrictors) require a different plunger! Nowhere have I seen any reference to a different plunger part. In the posts about the different restrictors, somewhere, John makes an offhand statement about the HP valve bodies being different in the length of the threaded part. I checked and they are! The bodies with a stamped restrictor are shorter than the ones with the machined restrictor! The different valve bodies use different plungers.....  You can see the different sizes of the stamped metal spacers at the yoke/can. In order to use a new plunger in the deeper body, I'll have to come up with some way to shim the assembly. Am I the only one who didn't know this? |
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Post by nikeajax on May 8, 2017 13:01:01 GMT -8
As I only have one of each, I didn't know about this!  Here's how I shimmed up my Divair:  The worsherz (washers) go inside the plunger BTW! JB |
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Post by vance on May 9, 2017 7:24:56 GMT -8
I took the thing apart again, and installed a longer plunger. There's about 3mm difference in length between the short and long plungers when the spring is inserted (21mm vs 18mm). I'll guess that that is the difference between the HP bodies as well, but I didn't take them out of the cans to measure.
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Post by vance on May 11, 2017 17:54:34 GMT -8
Jeff at Nuytco has made a really nice match in color to the Scuba blue hoses.  
I think it's real close. He can't make spiral hoses, only these. But he will make custom colors! I'm gonna git me some! And gray ones for my DivAir! |
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Post by nikeajax on May 11, 2017 18:00:09 GMT -8
Geez eh--close enough!  I'm gunna get some too  JB |
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Post by SeaRat on May 12, 2017 8:39:20 GMT -8
A week ago, I was ready to go to the pool to test out various regulators, one of which was my hybrid Healthways SCUBA. I had put an old Healthways hose on it, along with a 3M hose that was used for a PAPR (Powered Air Purifying Respirator). The PAPR hose was new, having gotten it during my last days at work. Well, there was a swim meet, and so I could not get it into the water. I took the regulator out of the car, and it stayed on the tank for a few more days. Then, last Tuesday, I saw something that gave me a pause; the Healthways hose, which looked pretty good when I put it on the regulator had split catastrophically. No warning, and apparently only having the pull of the hose itself when mounted vertically. There was a spot that had a problem, and I had put glue on it, but it seemed intact and good, with good resilience and "feel" when I put it on. Here are the photos.  This shows the regulator as it was, with the hose split up toward the regulator (the shorter one was the Healthways original hose).  Here is the split hose. Note that the area where I thought there was a problem (with the glue) was not where it split. If I had used this in the water, and it suffered this kind of split, the regulator would have free-flowed pretty badly as this was on the exhalation side. But if such a hose were on the inhalation side, that would be bad. It seems that the hoses Jeff at Nuytco is making are coming out at a good time. John |
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Post by vance on May 23, 2017 21:15:13 GMT -8
My new blue hoses! Jeff is putting them in the mail tomorrow! 
I can't wait to put them on the Scuba!! |
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Post by vance on May 26, 2017 20:59:34 GMT -8
If I had used this (hose) in the water, and it suffered this kind of split, the regulator would have free-flowed pretty badly as this was on the exhalation side. But if such a hose were on the inhalation side, that would be bad. It seems that the hoses Jeff at Nuytco is making are coming out at a good time. John I wonder if it's a good idea to use the original Healthways, DivAir, or other unavailable DH hoses in open water, ever. Mine seem ok, but there doesn't seem to be any reason to take the chance of a failure, or to add the wear and tear on antique hoses. Why not save them for display? One'd only need a couple of hose loops to dive with. I think I will just use a couple of Hope Page mouthpieces with super stretch EPDM hoses to dive the DivAir or Healthways regs. Of course, one will be my spanky new blue ones! One could also do very well with a couple of USD mouthpieces and hoses. |
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Post by vance on May 26, 2017 21:02:36 GMT -8
I'm working on a couple Scubas now. I'm trying to get a couple-three of them set up with original exhaust diaphragms in them, (I have three good diaphragms). I'm just not real happy with makeshift membranes. I'm sure they work, but why not use the originals if possible? I like the bike innertube material for the diaphragm all right, but I'm not sure how it will hold up.
As an experiment, I'm coating the inside of one Scuba can which has lots of bare copper showing with silicone RTV. The stuff sticks like crazy, and should provide protection from corrosion. I am also coating the inside of the exhaust horn.
A couple of my other Scuba cans have no chrome left inside the exh horns, even though the rest of the chrome on the can is very good. I think the duckbill kept salt from rinsing out well. A good layer of RTV should protect the metal. I'll glue the duckbill in with the same stuff. Can't hurt!
I wouldn't worry about it so much, but the bulk of my diving will be in salt water. I've seen the damage the stuff does when it's given a chance. Maintenance will be important, but I'm not going to disassemble my regs to rinse them every time. Hopefully, the RTV will help.
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Post by SeaRat on May 27, 2017 6:58:02 GMT -8
I'm working on a couple Scubas now. I'm trying to get a couple-three of them set up with original exhaust diaphragms in them, (I have three good diaphragms). I'm just not real happy with makeshift membranes. I'm sure they work, but why not use the originals if possible? I like the bike innertube material for the diaphragm all right, but I'm not sure how it will hold up. As an experiment, I'm coating the inside of one Scuba can which has lots of bare copper showing with silicone RTV. The stuff sticks like crazy, and should provide protection from corrosion. I am also coating the inside of the exhaust horn. A couple of my other Scuba cans have no chrome left inside the exh horns, even though the rest of the chrome on the can is very good. I think the duckbill kept salt from rinsing out well. A good layer of RTV should protect the metal. I'll glue the duckbill in with the same stuff. Can't hurt! I wouldn't worry about it so much, but the bulk of my diving will be in salt water. I've seen the damage the stuff does when it's given a chance. Maintenance will be important, but I'm not going to disassemble my regs to rinse them every time. Hopefully, the RTV will help. Be careful what you use on the inside of the can, and ensure that it is not an inhalation hazard to you! Some coatings can give off hazardous vapors that you may inhale. Copper may also not be good for you to inhale. So look at the Material Safety Data Sheet on anything you put into the inside, and let it completely cure if you are going to use it. I've decided not to do much on the inside of my cans, as I will simply work with any corrosion and not have any potential hazard for breathing. John |
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Post by vance on May 27, 2017 20:43:14 GMT -8
True about off-gassing. However, a reasonable cure time should eliminate most of it. Paint doesn't stick well to chrome, so that's out unless you want to media blast the cans. The problem is salt water. You have to be able to protect the surfaces that are compromised, or take the thing completely apart to rinse every time. Fact is, I'm not going to do that. It has been demonstrated countless times.
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Post by vance on May 29, 2017 9:30:53 GMT -8
So, some more info on Scuba differences:  
As you can see, not only is one HP valve body longer, it has different threads. Also note the slight difference between the lever bases: one is angled, the other squared. Another small difference not shown is the adjusting screw being slotted on one vs an allen type on the other. I also found the clamp rings fit differently on some. I tried to install the brazed style on a couple regulators, but it fit too loose. I had to use the stamped style on them to keep the can covers tight. On others, the brazed ring works fine. I'm not sure why yet. The cans and covers all seem to be the same. It could be the different diaphragms are more or less compressed or something. Dunno. I do know that the new repro silicone diaphragms are thicker which makes it hard to install the brazed clamp ring with the OEM screw.
 The picture shows the two styles of clamp. The installed one is the stamped stainless sheet metal affair that uses a screw and nut. The front one is chromed brass with brazed on ends. It has a different, V shaped channel where the other is a U cross section, and the brazed on end is threaded, requiring only a 4-40 screw. The stamped one is early, I think, as the brazed one is found on the Deluxe and Gold Label regulators, as well. Not sure. I know things get changed around over the years, but I have late regs with the stamped ring and early ones with the brass one, so I'm not claiming to know. We knew about the 3rd exhaust valve on some of the Scubas which was an auxiliary in case the exhaust diaphragm stuck to the oval opening. It is basically a wide rubber band that covers drillings in the exhaust horn. This was not present on some and there were no holes drilled in the horn. Some had the holes on both sides of the horn (6 all told) and some only had them on one side (3). Finally (for now) for the real nerds among us, there is a different number of exhaust drillings in the can: 
And, those most nerdy also might have noticed that the horns are significantly longer on the regulator on the right, which has a later serial # (over 20,000). Phil |
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Post by vance on May 29, 2017 9:45:40 GMT -8
The difference between the regulators is significant enough to note that you can't necessarily use a part from one reg on another. For example, I mixed up the yokes on a couple which have different length HP bodies when I was assembling them and one was too tight and the other too loose. While you can easily swap the complete valve body (including yoke and spacer), or diaphragms, etc., the various HP valves, their spacers, gland nuts, plungers, yokes, case rings, etc., require close inspection when replacing parts.
I was under the impression they were all the same until I gathered enough of them together to notice differences.
Phil
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I'm gunna get some too 
