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Post by SeaRat on Jan 28, 2019 23:19:46 GMT -8
John, if I'm reading it right: " It is - with modifications - until today in the offer and should therefore be the regulator with the longest production time of all ever offered first stages." I can't agree: the Sherwood first stage, that was quite ubiquitous and used by other companies, used on the Healthways Scuba Star is still being produced. The Mk.-II's first stage from Mark's images looks to me like an unbalanced flow-by piston: am I wrong? If I am wrong then yes, I will admit that it is their own, but if I'm right, it's still just a Sherwood with a facelift And judging by Mark blowing through that rebuild he just did, makes me believe I am right JB Actually, you have it backwards. Sherwood was making just about all the first stages for several different companies, amount them Healthways, White Stag, and Scubapro. Several years later, Sherwood decided to make their own line. Vintage Frank, in his book referenced above, shows ads with Healthways regulators with Scubapro labels. So the Scubapro Mk II can legitimately say it has the longest history of all first stages, as I think Mark is correct, and it can still be bought in their current line. On your questions, you are correct, but it is a Sherwood facelift of a Scubapro Mk II that actually happened. scubapro.johnsonoutdoors.com/regulators/systems/mk2-evor195-dive-regulator-system-intSherwood doesn't now offer a Mk II-like regulator: www.scuba.com/manufacturers/sherwood/regulators.html?rf=9&PKeyword=Sherwood%20Regulators&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI6IjUzL2S4AIVVRh9Ch3CJQr2EAAYASAAEgKJ3fD_BwEJohn
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 29, 2019 9:08:44 GMT -8
John, the point I was making, and not backward, is that Sherwood made this first stage: and it is still being produced: the Mk.-II is still a variant of this same Sherwood Granted, it isn't produced by Sherwood any longer. So, yes, I will strongly agree that this little workhorse has the longest run of any regulator, but I don't think ScubPro gets to lay claim to the honor because it existed even before Scubapro was an idea When Dick Anderson designed his first SH reg in 1955, he designed a piston first stage for it, but he realized that the Sherwood was far superior to his: before it was a scuba device, it was a medical device. JB
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2019 10:14:10 GMT -8
Bravo on your find mark!! I've had this one for several years and except for needing a good exhalation valve, it's 100% good to go. Those valves are very small compared to most. 001 by holat88, on Flickr 004 by holat88, on Flickr
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 29, 2019 10:59:52 GMT -8
Oh boy, I like that dust cap! Also, thanks for sharing the image Howard
If you compare Howard's image and mine you can see the similarities: JB
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 29, 2019 15:16:33 GMT -8
Jaybird, remember that White Stag thread, where I posted a link to Sherwood's history.
So while Sherwood-Selpak was making these parts and pieces for other companies, their own line started in 1972.
John
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 29, 2019 16:43:53 GMT -8
John, this has been a most enjoyable discussion: one of the things I like best about these intellectual-sparring sessions with you is that it never gets personal. You also don't do hit-and-run comments, which I find very chicken shucks of people: where they say what they want and never return to the conversation; that's very disingenuous-- GRRRR! JB
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 29, 2019 18:20:54 GMT -8
Jaybird, that's what I like about this forum; we CAN discuss things and go through details and get to the bottom of answers. Vintage Frank did a lot of research for his book on Scubapro, documenting 50 years worth of "stuff" that isn't generally known. Now, I'm going to show you a page from 50 Jare Scubapro, by Frank Werthwein, page 163, that will blow your mind: This is a Healthways Scubair-J with Scubapro markings on the second stage. According to the text, it came from their 1963 catelog. Here's the translation of that text: There was also a Scubair 300 with Scubapro markings in the 1963 catelog. Also, the Scubapro second stage underwent development, and was attached to a Scuba Star first stage (from the photos I see), the Polaris regulator came out in 1963, and the 1962 regulator, the 7100 for Scubapro (looking like a hybrid between the Scubair internal yolk and a differently-oriented piston first stage), a 7101 J-valve first stage, and finally the Mk II. John
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Post by tomcatpc on Jan 29, 2019 18:28:05 GMT -8
As for similarities in the 2nd stages...my ScubaPro 108 has two exhaust valves just like a lot of the Healthways did. The inner valve is 23mm and the outer was a slightly larger size. Mark
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 30, 2019 8:17:39 GMT -8
Mark, you're only using one, right-- I HOPE?!?!?! Using two 23mm mushrooms is going to make that thing doggy: Voit is the only other company I can think of that stacked them like HW & SP; there may have been others but I've never worked on them... JB
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Post by technidiver on Jan 30, 2019 13:26:50 GMT -8
Mark, you're only using one, right-- I HOPE?!?!?! Using two 23mm mushrooms is going to make that thing doggy: Voit is the only other company I can think of that stacked them like HW & SP; there may have been others but I've never worked on them... JB Jay, what was the purpose of the double mushroom design?? I just think it's a PITA to service. Especially when the valves are like rock solid and I can't get it out. TD
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 30, 2019 14:49:43 GMT -8
TD, the idea was that, if you were in a strong cross-current the two diaphragms would keep the water out of the regulator... Please keep in mind that people hadn't synced up to the idea that exhalation should be as close to natural breathing as possible. I believe John said they thought a diver was more efficient if they had to work harder with breathing JB
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Post by tomcatpc on Jan 30, 2019 18:09:47 GMT -8
If I don't like how it performs, I'll take one out. Mark
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Post by tomcatpc on Jul 15, 2019 17:45:25 GMT -8
I finally got to test dive this reg this evening. It worked just fine, the rebuild was a success. This regulator is just not a "performer", compared to my ScubaPro Mk.5/R-109 that I dove directly before the test dive...is like comparing a Chevy Vega to a Corvette*. The Mk.II seems to me to be a decent "entry level utility" regulator. The Mk.5 was so much a better breather. Having said that, I had fun burning up a 1000 PSI tank down to the J-Valve kicking in (yes I use J-Valves...gasp!!!). I like this little reg for the history aspect and had fun rebuilding it. Don't think this will be a daily diver though. Mark
*I have never actually drove a Vega or a Corvette...
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Post by SeaRat on Jul 15, 2019 18:05:17 GMT -8
The Chevette was our first new car, as a married couple, and it taught Chris to drive a stick shift.
I think this Scubapro could be rated the same way, not a performer, but a regulator anyone could afford to learn how to dive.
John
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Post by tomcatpc on Jul 15, 2019 18:06:49 GMT -8
Never drove a Chevette either... I agree with you about the Mk.II. Funny thing is that I heard ScubaPro started as Healthways "performance line"? Comparing the ScubaPro Mk. II to my Healthways Scubair...I think the Scubair is the better performer, at least my opinion. I have not dove my Healthways Scuba Star since last year, but I'd guess I would put it over the Mk. II as well? Anyway...maybe I need to adjust the demand lever in my Mk.II?, or I could just leave it as is? It is not going to be a regular diver. Still had fun with it and that is all that matters. Mark
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