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Post by vance on Nov 21, 2019 14:17:22 GMT -8
I managed to get my hands on a NED rebranded Sportsways DualAir recently. It seems like a pretty good regulator, and is interesting because it has a tilt valve second stage. Unfortunately, the valve leaks. I tried to clean it up with some very fine sandpaper glued to a stick, but no luck. Are these tilt valves the standard valve one would find in a Sportsways single hose second stage, but bent? Or is the wire longer? It seems longer, but I haven't compared it to one out of a SH reg yet. Anyone have success with these?
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Post by snark3 on Nov 21, 2019 14:53:15 GMT -8
I don't know if its the same as the single hose regs, but I have several early Sportsways single hosers if you need me to open one up and measure the tilt valve wire
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Post by nikeajax on Nov 21, 2019 15:09:58 GMT -8
Phil, on my HW Scuba Star, I get 1-9/16". I'm pretty sure you can revulcanize a new seat onto the old one by heating the valve up and pressing a new one on until it cools.
JB
PS You stink!
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Post by vance on Nov 21, 2019 15:20:18 GMT -8
I don't know if its the same as the single hose regs, but I have several early Sportsways single hosers if you need me to open one up and measure the tilt valve wire Thanks for the offer. I appreciate it! However, I have one or two around somewhere that I was just too lazy to look for and dissect. I'll do it if no one knows offhand. Even if they are shorter, the valve part is the same, I'm certain. The spring is also the same as the ones I made. If necessary, I can add wire to make up for it. I have never really felt like I got a good, consistent seal on the Sportsways tilters. They just don't seem to have a way to guide the soft seat onto the hard seat in the same position every time it moves. The Nemrod tilters have a much more positive guide. Obviously, though, this is a workable system which performed just fine in thousands of regulators.
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Post by vance on Nov 21, 2019 15:24:38 GMT -8
Phil, on my HW Scuba Star, I get 1-9/16". I'm pretty sure you can revulcanize a new seat onto the old one by heating the valve up and pressing a new one on until it cools. JB PS You stink! As to the postscript, you are correct. Sorry! As to the revulcanizing technique you describe, I'd like to hear more. Would you dig out the old seat and press a new one in with heat applied. What material? And how would the heat be applied? Or, would an o-ring glued into the dug out channel maybe work?
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Post by nikeajax on Nov 21, 2019 16:08:37 GMT -8
Phil, my idea is that you'd use a piece of 1/16" neoprene sheet and use a smaller sized paper punch to cut the seat, but first you'd want to center punch a hole in that: that way you can eyeball the alignment with the paper punch. You'll want some kind of jig to hold the seat when it gets heated: a piece of steel with a hole drilled through. Remove the old neoprene. Place the new soft seat on he shaft of the needle valve some distance away with some kind of heat sink to protect the soft seat. Heat the needle valve until it's red hot: remove heat sink and push the needle valve against the jig until cool. This should work! I hope it makes sense to you, call me if you want a verbal...
JB
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Post by vance on Nov 21, 2019 16:15:06 GMT -8
No, I think I understand. I will dissect a Nemrod Snark III LP soft seat sooner or later, which seems to be an o-ring, to go to school on it. That'd make things easy, eh?
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Post by SeaRat on Nov 21, 2019 17:59:48 GMT -8
Phil,
First, congratulations on this acquisition. That's quite a find!
Second, your question. I looked up in Basic Scuba, and the part number for the tilt valve in the Sport Diver single hose regulator is 400-8, while the part number for the tilt valve in the Duel Air is 1325-5. So I doubt that they are actually the same. In this book, he states for trouble shooting the Duel Air:
'Hope this helps.
john
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Post by vance on Nov 22, 2019 11:21:20 GMT -8
I took a valve out of my SportDiver regulator to compare it to the DualAir valve. They only differ by the bends in the DualAir's. Seat and length is the same. I bent the SportDiver valve and fitted it successfully. The reg operates correctly. Now I need a valve for my SportDiver..... The culprit: The soft seat is hard as a rock. Anyone have a source for these?
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Post by nikeajax on Nov 22, 2019 11:51:46 GMT -8
Phil, that is the very same type used in the HW's! They're made out of unobtainium alloy: your best bet is to revulcanize an old one. Anyway, I haven't been able to find any sources...
JB
EDIT: Straighten the old one you have as a source!
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Post by SeaRat on Nov 22, 2019 12:07:16 GMT -8
Phil,
I have been curious for years about whether there was a significant Venturi on the tilt valve second stage of the Duel Air? I know that most of the tilt valve second stages on a single hose regulator have none, but what about the Duel Air? It seems to suggest that there was one. How does it breathe?
John
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Post by snark3 on Nov 22, 2019 12:49:17 GMT -8
Phil if you cant find a soft seat would it be possible to use the old one to make a mold, then use something like flex seal so make a new soft seat?
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Post by nikeajax on Nov 22, 2019 14:25:20 GMT -8
Skip, though I've never used Flex Seal, I don't think the bond would be strong enough: I could be wrong I forget what I was doing, I think burning the o-ring out of an old lantern, the best way to get them out BTW: I noticed when I was done there was still some melted and fused neoprene sticking to the side seat, and it really didn't want to come off very easily! JB
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Post by vance on Nov 22, 2019 14:35:36 GMT -8
Phil, I have been curious for years about whether there was a significant Venturi on the tilt valve second stage of the Duel Air? I know that most of the tilt valve second stages on a single hose regulator have none, but what about the Duel Air? It seems to suggest that there was one. How does it breathe? John It appears to be quite strong, and the regulator breathes easily. I wondered about this too. The single jet hole is quite large and points right down the pipe pretty close to the intake horn. Air escapes from the valve "arm" slot toward the can center, as well, but the air blast from the jet is considerable.
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Post by vance on Nov 22, 2019 14:40:46 GMT -8
I believe I found a NOS seat, so I may not get around to experimenting with retreading these. It makes sense that Sportsways and HW used the same seats. I wonder if the Voit tilt valve regs did also? They look the same from pics I've seen.
Yup, I found some NOS ones for a reasonable price. Now the Sport Diver gets fixed!
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