Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 20, 2005 9:31:13 GMT -8
I am just curious. What would most people here consider to be vintage equipment, in terms of age?
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Post by nemrod on Oct 20, 2005 10:32:00 GMT -8
"I am just curious. What would most people here consider to be vintage equipment, in terms of age? "
My definition and it is mine--there is no rule book----it is simply my opinion of what vintage diving is and others will vary.
Vintage diving to me is diving with equipment, techniques and procedures as would have occured up to about 1975. In the early 70s some gear was available that is not exactly vintage style and there is some modern equipment like JetFins that has vintage roots so there is no absolute here. It seems most people, even die hards, mix and match. Some single hose units are vintage, some BCs are vintage like a Fenzy and horsecollar types. In it's purest form it is mask and fins and double hose regulator on a steel 72 with cotton harmess and nothing else. I pick 1975 because that is when the evil PadI came on strong, BC became required, octapus became mandatory, USD turned into junk etc, all subjective, some may place the date further back than that. It is not clear to me when USD actually quit double hose production, I think I remember them on the shelf up to about 75 so that is another reason I pick that approximate time. I am not a purist but I don't think a newer Conshelf or such single hose is vintage or split fins or thermoplastic fins or late type non oval masks in clear silicone but nobody will shoot you, dive what you got and go from there. I am just rambling, got to take The Boys for a walk.
James
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 20, 2005 11:36:53 GMT -8
My definition and it is mine--there is no rule book----it is simply my opinion of what vintage diving is and others will vary. Vintage diving to me is diving with equipment, techniques and procedures as would have occured up to about 1975. In the early 70s some gear was available that is not exactly vintage style and there is some modern equipment like JetFins that has vintage roots so there is no absolute here. It seems most people, even die hards, mix and match. Some single hose units are vintage, some BCs are vintage like a Fenzy and horsecollar types. In it's purest form it is mask and fins and double hose regulator on a steel 72 with cotton harmess and nothing else. I pick 1975 because that is when the evil PadI came on strong, BC became required, octapus became mandatory, USD turned into junk etc, all subjective, some may place the date further back than that. It is not clear to me when USD actually quit double hose production, I think I remember them on the shelf up to about 75 so that is another reason I pick that approximate time. I am not a purist but I don't think a newer Conshelf or such single hose is vintage or split fins or thermoplastic fins or late type non oval masks in clear silicone but nobody will shoot you, dive what you got and go from there. I am just rambling, got to take The Boys for a walk. James heh, I was too busy being born in '75 to notice the trends in diving. My exposure to vintage gear is largely in films, like the Creature from the Black Lagoon. I got interested in vintage diving largely because I like the more unrestricted style of diving that used to be prevalent. And I like the more self sufficient attitudes. People didn't need to be hand held everywhere. I rebuild most of my gear, and catch flak for it on occasion. And I generally don't dive with 20 layers or redudancy. The training seems almost comical to me now. I've seen people certified as Advanced Open Water go into uncontrolled descents because they have no real conception of proper weighting. They pile on the weights and hope that the BCD can compensate. And, for God's sake, no one would offer a certification like "Peak Bouyancy Control!" The idea that core skills are an "add-on" class drives me nuts. I guess this conversation has moved to a more interesting question is, what draws you to vintage diving? |
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Post by Captain on Oct 20, 2005 13:11:17 GMT -8
Originally started diving that way in 1957 but it wasn't vintage then it was state of the art. Switched to modern gear around 1970 and about 3 years ago discovered there were divers interested in the now vintage equiptment. I still had some of my old gear and bought a few pieces on e-bay and have been involved ever since
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Post by william bonney on Oct 20, 2005 17:28:01 GMT -8
Same here, started diving in 67 with a ymca cert. Double hoses and steel 72.........no maywest. Didn't add that until 69 and long with a sportsways sport diver 2 and a brand new black sportsways 72.
Dove overseas with doublehoses and my sportdiver 2. Served last 14 months in s. calif. and dove there with upgraded equip. A wetsuit and weights.
Didn't get my first bc until 77 or 78 when the dive club I thought I wanted to be part of greatly chastized me about not having one and using a doublehose. Got the bc but shook them off. Picked up a Tekna shortly after. dove until the early nineties, then with both of my sons.
Both lost interest in mid nineties and I was busy with other things, didn't get into diving again until a year ago when my youngest son got back into it and wanted to go to the flower gardens. Shortly after that I watched a navy class training in their pool on TV with what I later learned were Mentors and then I found out about you guys and bought enough parts to rejuveinate my old doublehose.
Been spending money since.....on doublehose equip. At this stage in life, I can now afford all the equipment I wanted twenty five to thirty five years ago..........ah me.
Billy
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Post by nemrod on Oct 21, 2005 0:21:41 GMT -8
I did dive my Mistral back in the day but frankly I mostly used my Calypso J on a steel 72. Did not get a BC until the 70s. What rejuvenated my interest in older gear was when a few years ago I bought a kayak. I wanted to par everything down to the most minimal possible. After trying to figure out where to put my BC and back ups for back ups and switch it all to a second tank and all that I remembered that I used to dive without any of that junk. I frantically started digging for my ol' buddy, the Mistral and when I found it the site that greeted me was not a happy one. BUT, after new hoses and bits and pieces it is as good as new, happy and shiny. What it really needs now is a set of those elusive yellow hoses to be complete. In any case, in the search for parts for it I came across all of you and decided that this is the way it is meant to be. Now I too now have the Royal Aqua-Master I wanted as a young diver and in fact have three and I ain't going back to single hoses for anything. James
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JohnA
Pro Diver
Posts: 134
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Post by JohnA on Oct 21, 2005 5:31:18 GMT -8
1975 is a good cut off date, that is the year I was first certified and I can remember that my instructor told us that we should not even consider a double hose regulator but they were still being sold. We did not use power inflators/octopuses’, but we did use a fairly “modern” horse collar BC.
I would add though the years 1975 – 1980 as a “techno-vintage” era. A lot of real interesting gear was developed during those years by the large and small manufactures. There seemed to be a real learning curve going on then and the dive companies weren’t afraid to take a chance. There is a long list of slightly bizarre to totally bizarre gear produced in that time frame.
John
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Post by jamiep3 on Oct 21, 2005 6:17:46 GMT -8
Allright, here is a wrinkle for you. I have a Seatec Sunfish Horsecollar. Since I got it off of ebay, I don't know how old it is, but I would guess less than 10 years. It has an oral inflator only, no connection for a LP inflator, and a CO2 inflator.
Obviously not vintage by age, but how about by design?
For the record I started in 1978 with steel 72's on a Dacor hard pac, Calypso J, a Dacor Snorkel Vest/Mae West, Origninal style USD Atlantis mask(remember the neoprene pad to block your nose with?) and Rocket fins. Still use the same rocket fins today.
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Post by nemrod on Oct 21, 2005 10:15:13 GMT -8
"Obviously not vintage by age, but how about by design?"
Since I am not a purist I think our BC is suitable vintage. While it is not of the age it is of that style and fucntion so I would call it vintage style. I would probably give it a pass (thumbs up)--lol---if that matters to you. There is new equipment out there that is sufficiently vintage in function and style that I call them vintage. Certainly for example, the Giant UDT fins sold by this very website, if those aren't vintage-- what could be more vintage than UDT fins? And there is other stuff like that if you dig around.
"I would add though the years 1975 – 1980 as a “techno-vintage” era."
Yes, that was an od era, the rise of product liability especially in the 80s killed off experimentation. Tekna---lol-one of my favorite companies was a product of this era and while they lasted into the 80s their odd designs were certainly the result of thinking slightly out of the box. Ohter companies alos came and went during that era with interesting gear. Nowadays we are stuck in a period of "Unithink", everything is the same and mostly very junky. We actually have people trying to measure the "torque" of a dive fin---what are they talking about---this to me represents the dreggs of creative thinking and why some of us are returning to the earlier, simpler and actually more advanced type of diving and equipment.
Sidetraking --but the DIR mantra requires that a regulator can be taken apart underwater---I can take my Teknas apart underwater so I guess they are DIR --lol.
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 21, 2005 11:56:14 GMT -8
Well, if no one rudely outbids me, I should be the owner of an Aquamaster in a little over 9 hours.
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Post by nemrod on Oct 21, 2005 19:18:44 GMT -8
OK, did you win the regulator?
James
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 21, 2005 21:48:54 GMT -8
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Post by Yank Down Under on Oct 21, 2005 22:11:24 GMT -8
What is vintage? The dictionary does not define it in years. Usually it is anything 25 years old or older. Anything 50 years old or older is antique, like me.
The time frames come from the laws of some state that classify motor vehicles for registration purposes. Even the US Govt allows vintage vehicles to enter the USA if they are 25 years old or older, and do not meet safety or emmisions standards. I am in the antique category and my safety emissions are suspect too ;D.
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Post by nemrod on Oct 22, 2005 9:52:57 GMT -8
Well then Creed, I think this is your first double hose is that correct? Congrats on the DA, looks like it will need some TLC before you get it wet. Given the large number of dive sites here in Kansaw I know that it will be diffucult for you to hold back. Where do you plan to dive that thing?
James
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 22, 2005 10:57:29 GMT -8
Well then Creed, I think this is your first double hose is that correct? Congrats on the DA, looks like it will need some TLC before you get it wet. Given the large number of dive sites here in Kansaw I know that it will be diffucult for you to hold back. Where do you plan to dive that thing? James Anywhere deeper than 10 feet! Yeah, this is my first double hose. I would love to see the looks on the other divers if I whipped this out on a tablerock boat trip. Of course, now I have one more reason to carve out an afternoon in Wichita. |
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