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Post by Jim Perdway on Sept 7, 2021 18:45:44 GMT -8
I'd like to get this White Stag going, but I'm not sure how to get at the exhaust valve (which has completely deteriorated). It sure seems like this little cage for it does not detach anywhere, however it’s hard to imagine they would design it so the valve is trapped and irreplaceable. Any tips on what I should do? Thanks  White stag by Jim Perdway, on Flickr |
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Post by SeaRat on Sept 7, 2021 19:14:45 GMT -8
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Post by Jim Perdway on Sept 7, 2021 19:19:45 GMT -8
Interesting- yes it seems very likely that’s what it was
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Post by SeaRat on Sept 7, 2021 20:04:56 GMT -8
Okay, the valve is trapped, and you will probably have to get that inner mushroom with a needle nose pliers, and from the inside by cutting the holding part off. Do the best that you can, and get the heneliolaneh material out.
Once that is out, you have a choice. You really don’t need two mushrooms, and one choice is to leave the inner one without the mushroom. The other choice is to fold one up, and put it into the space with the holding tube up, and work it through the hole. Once partway through, it can be pulled until it seats. It works best if it has been coated with silicone grease.
The down side of having two mushrooms, even silicone ones, is that the breathing resistance will be higher. The upside is that it will be a much drier breather.
John
PS, I have a similar regulator from White Stag, a SEA 5000 Lung, and it has only one exhalation valve. Both the exhalation valve and the diaphragm on this regulator is silicone too, and still viable. I think you have an earlier version that was a takeoff on a Healthways second stage. If that’s the case, then you have the duel exhalation valve setup from above. Looking at your photo, I think the seat is also reversible, but you’ll have to confirm that by looking into the outside piece and seeing whether there is a seat on the outside. If so, all you have to do is reverse it and you have a new seat.
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Post by Jim Perdway on Sept 8, 2021 0:16:35 GMT -8
Thank you for the info and advice John. I think I will try the double valve as originally designed. The valve is already pretty small so I’m curious to see how bad it exhales doubled up haha
This White Stag I have does not have any internal components, but the design looks very similar to this 108. I'm thinking I can transfer over the 108 poppet (flipped seat looks good), lever, and diaphragm and it will work. One thing I'm unsure of is how much to tighten that little nut by the lever.
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Post by james1979 on Sept 8, 2021 4:18:19 GMT -8
I have a couple early 108s that use the stacked valve exhaust....John covered the pro/con of the stacked valves quite well. I'll just add that if you only use one, the inner one will theoretically give better work of breathing than the outer (due to being kept in the air pocket).
On the poppet stem nut, that will set lever height. Unfortunately, with no slot in the end of the stem there's no easy way to set it. Best bet would be to install the poppet and put the nut on with 1 to 2 threads showing, then install the inlet fitting (holding the lever down so the orifice doesn't score the seat) and check lever height. If (when) it isn't quite right, remove inlet fitting and adjust nut then assemble and try again.
Best,
James
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Post by antique diver on Sept 8, 2021 5:25:28 GMT -8
It was a common practice in the 60's to remove one of the mushroom valves on the Healthways regs to decrease exhalation effort. Glenn Egstrom (UCLA) was doing work of breathing studies at the time, and made that suggestion at the instructor course I attended in 1968. When he said something we listened!
I suggest using a little dishwashing liquid soap on the stem of a new exhaling valve to ease its installation. The soap will quickly wash away, leaving the valve securely fastened.
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Post by nikeajax on Sept 8, 2021 7:08:09 GMT -8
I agree with John, just use one, and with James about putting it in the PITA location, as it will be in a protected from the cross currents that it was supposed to help with in the first place. Also, because we are forced to use snorkel mushrooms, with thick plastic bodies, it's a very good practice to shim the stems to make up for the thin walled metal:  Otherwise they have a tendency to breathe wet, which, with one of the stems being inside that cage, it would be more than difficult to shim.  Just a thought  Jaybird |
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Post by Jim Perdway on Sept 8, 2021 7:24:50 GMT -8
Since the vintage masters approve and encourage the single valve, then single it is!
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Post by vance on Sept 8, 2021 8:36:03 GMT -8
On the poppet stem nut, that will set lever height. Unfortunately, with no slot in the end of the stem there's no easy way to set it. Best bet would be to install the poppet and put the nut on with 1 to 2 threads showing, then install the inlet fitting (holding the lever down so the orifice doesn't score the seat) and check lever height. If (when) it isn't quite right, remove inlet fitting and adjust nut then assemble and try again. Best, James By this description, I'm assuming the poppet post is not square and the poppet needs to be held in order to move the nut. A pair of needlenose pliers can be used to hold the seat end when the orifice is removed. Stephan, I have the lever for sure, and probably a poppet laying around somewhere. You can have them, so you don't have to rob the 108. Pls post a photo of the poppet, and I'll look for one. |
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Post by Jim Perdway on Sept 8, 2021 10:02:54 GMT -8
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Post by james1979 on Sept 8, 2021 10:45:11 GMT -8
Yep, looks like Phil was right. As long as the White Stag valve body is a square opening (preventing the poppet from spinning) you don't need to pull the inlet fitting to adjust it. I had a brain fart thinking they were like the Aqualung regs. Respectfully, James |
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Post by nikeajax on Sept 8, 2021 12:09:23 GMT -8
Here you can see where both SP and HW had that goofy stacked mushroom config.:  Your MR-12 used to have a plastic insert in the exhaust tee that gave it the same function...  I may still have it if you really want it!  Jus' so ya know... JB |
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Post by SeaRat on Sept 8, 2021 15:09:20 GMT -8
The reason that these regulators have some interchangeable parts is that, if my memory is correct, Sherwood was actually manufacturing most of the regulators for these companies. That was before Sherwood decided to become a manufacturer under its own name.
John
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Post by nikeajax on Sept 8, 2021 15:12:14 GMT -8
John, this is my understanding as well JB |
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I may still have it if you really want it! 
