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Post by vance on Dec 29, 2022 15:57:59 GMT -8
Jb's thread on making custom hoses has got me going on a simple SH to DH conversion, again.
I made the Conways DH regulator out of a Conshelf VI first stage, a Dacor splitter, and some Sportsways second stage parts. It all required a lot of machining. Lots of vintage parts were modded irrevocably to make it work. It is a good regulator, but my goal has always been to figure out a simpler conversion that doesn't require so much difficult modification.
I'd love to figure out a simple conversion that only requires normal home shop tools. That ain't going to happen. The second stage is the problem.
I've figured out, and made, a very simple, bolt-in second stage. Cool, but you have to make it or have it made. It's the same idea as the Olympic 4/800 second stage I finally ended up with.
The Titan II conversion second stage is much simpler to make than my "simple" stand-alone second stage, since it's basically only the top half. Even that is well beyond most home modders.
What evs. I still want to try a new one.
Stay tuned.
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Post by nikeajax on Dec 29, 2022 16:46:30 GMT -8
So it's kinda like that dumb "Mitral-2 Electric Boogaloo"? I suspect yours will at least breathe well! Just in case ya didn't get the reference... JB
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Post by SeaRat on Dec 29, 2022 17:27:45 GMT -8
Jb's thread on making custom hoses has got me going on a simple SH to DH conversion, again. I made the Conways DH regulator out of a Conshelf VI first stage, a Dacor splitter, and some Sportsways second stage parts. It all required a lot of machining. Lots of vintage parts were modded irrevocably to make it work. It is a good regulator, but my goal has always been to figure out a simpler conversion that doesn't require so much difficult modification. I'd love to figure out a simple conversion that only requires normal home shop tools. That ain't going to happen. The second stage is the problem. I've figured out, and made, a very simple, bolt-in second stage. Cool, but you have to make it or have it made. It's the same idea as the Olympic 4/800 second stage I finally ended up with.The Titan II conversion second stage is much simpler to make than my "simple" stand-alone second stage, since it's basically only the top half. Even that is well beyond most home modders. What evs. I still want to try a new one. Stay tuned. Okay, here's some thinking I have on this project. We know the difference between a single hose and a double hose regulator. The double hose has the demand stage away from the diver's mouth, either on the chest or behind between the diver's shoulder blades. We also know that the mouthpiece of the single hose is removable. What if we simply removed the mouthpiece, and provided a double hose hose look to the diver from the single hose's mouthpiece. Most of the single hose have a pretty good Venturi coming into the mouthpiece. The second problem is what to do with the return hose loop. The end of this look needs to be at the diaphragm of the regulator, or in certain positions it will leak air. So we hove a cover to the single hose regulator, but not a connection for a hose. If we remove the purge button on this cover, we have access to the inside of the cover over the diaphragm. How about building a mushroom valve holder into the cover where the purge button used to be. Then, all we need is something manufactured to cover that cover. We'd also need to cover the front vents, if any existed. Then, we could put this newly formed double hose second stage anywhere we wanted. It could be chest mounted, or back mounted. It could use existing BCDs too. What do you think, Phil? John
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Post by Aquala1 on Dec 30, 2022 7:47:42 GMT -8
John, would that make it a triple hose?
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Post by vance on Dec 30, 2022 8:38:11 GMT -8
Huh. That is sort of hard to imagine. I get the idea, though. Lots of hoops.
You'd need to mount the second stage body sideways in order to have the hoseloop coming off sideways rather than sticking out front and back. Or, use elbows. But, a 90 degree turn might inhibit the venturi. Maybe not...
The intake horn adapter could also make for a better hose fit than the oval mouthpiece flange. You'd need a plug/cover for the no longer wanted exhaust hole in the top box. That could also serve as a mounting point for a harness or a plate?
On the exhaust side, a horn elbow would need to be made with an integrated WW mushroom valve like a DBE, or made so a WW can be fitted. A whole new cover with a higher dome would probably be needed to keep the diaphragm and mushroom apart.
Seems like a 3D print job to me.
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Post by vance on Dec 30, 2022 8:42:13 GMT -8
John, would that make it a triple hose? It would have 3 hoses... Of course, this is a second stage regulator that needs an LP air source. A remote first stage or a surface supply is necessary.
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Post by SeaRat on Dec 30, 2022 9:46:15 GMT -8
John, would that make it a triple hose? Yup, it would. John
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Post by SeaRat on Dec 31, 2022 12:56:36 GMT -8
Huh. That is sort of hard to imagine. I get the idea, though. Lots of hoops. You'd need to mount the second stage body sideways in order to have the hoseloop coming off sideways rather than sticking out front and back. Or, use elbows. But, a 90 degree turn might inhibit the venturi. Maybe not... The intake horn adapter could also make for a better hose fit than the oval mouthpiece flange. You'd need a plug/cover for the no longer wanted exhaust hole in the top box. That could also serve as a mounting point for a harness or a plate?On the exhaust side, a horn elbow would need to be made with an integrated WW mushroom valve like a DBE, or made so a WW can be fitted. A whole new cover with a higher dome would probably be needed to keep the diaphragm and mushroom apart. Seems like a 3D print job to me. Just thinking this through, I think I can do this in a much simplier manner. How about just bringing the exhaust back to the original mouthpiece, and exhausting it through the normal channel. All that would be required is a "T" that would accept the larger hose loop. And then, simply ignore the slight rebreathing of what's in the single hose mouthpiece. So the major mod would be a "T" to hook into the single hose mouthpiece. I'm looking to use a Dacor Enduro secosnd stage, which uses the diaphragm as an exhaust too. John
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Post by vance on Dec 31, 2022 13:53:24 GMT -8
That would be really easy, and would make a single hose second stage into a double hose second stage. This doesn't float my particular boat, due to the remote first stage. I've got several DH second stage regulators that I haven't set up already! However, I'd love to see what you come up with.
Would you make a bracket to mount the regulator to the tank/backpack/plate, or would you use a harness for back or front mount?
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Post by vance on Dec 31, 2022 14:06:03 GMT -8
The idea of a new exhaust cover with provision for a WW/non-return valve and an intake horn adapter got me looking at a second stage body and a Dacor 100 first stage. I think the unused exhaust valve hole and exhaust T mount could be used to attach the first and second stages together. A short hose would be the air supply. The splitter could be used or not.
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Post by james1979 on Dec 31, 2022 15:33:38 GMT -8
The idea of a new exhaust cover with provision for a WW/non-return valve and an intake horn adapter got me looking at a second stage body and a Dacor 100 first stage. I think the unused exhaust valve hole and exhaust T mount could be used to attach the first and second stages together. A short hose would be the air supply. The splitter could be used or not. Is that an Aqualung/USD 1085 second stage? Just curious for diameter info/etc. Cover with a 1 inch horn shouldn't be too hard to do... but I'm thinking mount the second at a 90 degree angle. Then you don't need an elbow for the intake (mouthpiece to hose junction) and the cover horn could project straight out (easier print orientation). A simple collar to build up the mouthpiece flange will let you put a gas mask hose on it.... it may take a true 1 inch hose as is.
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Post by james1979 on Dec 31, 2022 15:37:12 GMT -8
Just further thinking on it... all three holes (exhaust T mounts, and exhaust stem hole) could be used as mount points for a split clamp to clamp it to the barrel of the first stage, with different size clamps for different firsts (That Dacor, an SP Mk2, really any post style 1st stage)!
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Post by vance on Dec 31, 2022 22:47:39 GMT -8
Yes, it's a Conshelf VI. The mp oval is a bit loose for a 1" hose, probably very loose for a gas mask hose. It would need an adapter or a sleeve over it.
I had thought of a 90 degree orientation. Better intake/venturi flow w/o an elbow. An easy method to couple the 1st and 2nd together like a clamp that grips the first stage IP spring barrel might work well.
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Post by james1979 on Jan 1, 2023 6:53:21 GMT -8
Yes, it's a Conshelf VI. The mp oval is a bit loose for a 1" hose, probably very loose for a gas mask hose. It would need an adapter or a sleeve over it. I had thought of a 90 degree orientation. Better intake/venturi flow w/o an elbow. An easy method to couple the 1st and 2nd together like a clamp that grips the first stage IP spring barrel might work well. What's the diameter of the spring barrel? I have the second stage cover/exhaust horn modelled, and the clamp 90% done.... I can probably whip this out and get it and a HP deflector headed that way soon.
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Post by vance on Jan 1, 2023 8:47:10 GMT -8
Love it! This would be an easy conversion for anyone to do. John's idea takes off!
The spring barrel is 1.2525". I guess there's .0025 of chrome.
The parts look great! Is there an integrated WW?
I tried a bit of silicone tubing cut off of a duckbill over the mp oval. I suppose heat shrink tubing will work well, too. My new silicone hoses fit fine with a sleeve, and an oval clamp would do 'er. GM hoses might need a bit more thickness.
The last part is fabricating a short hose.
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