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Post by vance on Dec 18, 2021 19:29:35 GMT -8
James sent me a Trieste diaphragm which I received today. MUCH improvement over the repro. It fits and seals nicely, making it much easier to install, and is very responsive.
Mine is a V0.1, so I gather that improvements to this one are already underway. This is a big step forward!
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Post by antique diver on Dec 18, 2021 19:58:17 GMT -8
I received the second version of the new diaphragm from James this week, and it's a beauty. I suggested a couple of changes after testing and abusing the first prototype, and he quickly got to work on a new mold to incorporate the changes. There is a bit of reinforcement added around the disc edges, and the outer rim is a little thicker too. Bench testing has shown very good results that will likely have you disposing of your stiff old hard breathing original Voit diaphragm. That one never fit the can grooves properly either, causing difficulty in assembly and even occasional wet breathing surprises. I'm letting it sit installed for a couple of days to see how the rim settles into place, then some more testing with a Voit mouthpiece and a VDH one. Also with and without any venturi enhancements in place on the second stage body. From what I have seen so far I think most Trieste owners will find the improvement is such that they may find no need for venturi tricks. I like it. More news soon.
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Post by james1979 on Dec 19, 2021 6:59:02 GMT -8
James sent me a Trieste diaphragm which I received today. MUCH improvement over the repro. It fits and seals nicely, making it much easier to install, and is very responsive. Mine is a V0.1, so I gather that improvements to this one are already underway. This is a big step forward! Just a heads up on the v0.1.... main issue that Antique Diver found with it is that the silicon over the friction plate is thin enough that the edge of the friction plate can tear through unless you are quite careful. We aren't sure if it would tear through in normal use, or if it was a shipping or installation issue (either way it's too thin). I'm not sure if I had communicated that clearly. Just be careful with it... I can't afford to loose a guinea pig.... I mean beta tester! lol In general, if the testing Antique Diver is doing on v0.2 continues to go well then I anticipate printing a second bold and starting to crank them out for interested parties after Christmas. Coloring them adds a step to the process, so default will be clear silicone with friction plate being whatever color is loaded in the printer when I make them! Respectfully, James
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Post by vance on Dec 26, 2021 17:36:51 GMT -8
Yesterday, I made a Trieste diaphragm, using the Bill T technique. I turned a PVC fitting (like the diluter mold) with all the matching ridges at the rim, and used the bottom box to form that side.
An HW Scuba lever interface disk was used, and a second cut down disk is on top. It works very well. I'll add photos later.
Cool! This is a great way to make a diaphragm. I won't ever worry about acquiring a reg with a bad diaphragm again!
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Post by vance on Dec 28, 2021 9:12:56 GMT -8
I'll use a slightly smaller lever disk next time. It can't get more than maybe 1/8" smaller in diameter or the lever tips will fall off the sides!
Another working Titeste!
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Post by nikeajax on Dec 28, 2021 9:22:14 GMT -8
PY, you know you can make yer own disks with fiberglass sheets and resin, right?
JB
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Post by james1979 on Dec 28, 2021 9:59:13 GMT -8
I'll use a slightly smaller lever disk next time. It can't get more than maybe 1/8" smaller in diameter or the lever tips will fall off the sides!
Another working Titeste! Looks great! I love that different tools available lead to different approaches that converge on similar parts. Does your tool set allow for larger outer diameters (i.e. big enough to do a DAAM diaphragm)? For those that don't want to lay up their own, I'm waiting on Antique Diver's in water tests (upcoming, I believe) on the 0.2 that I made, but out of water he seemed pleased with it. Once we're sure we didn't miss anything (read "I didn't F up the design) I can start pouring more.
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Post by vance on Dec 28, 2021 16:04:56 GMT -8
My lathe doesn't have the capacity to turn the 3 1/2" blank without a specially modded tool holder. I took it down to the max for this.
An HW diaphragm's diameter is beyond its capacity, unless I use wood turning tools and techniques. That might work, but the available HW repro diaphragms are excellent.
However, I'm thinking about a Sportsways DH diaphragm....
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Post by james1979 on Dec 29, 2021 7:38:12 GMT -8
Update on the v0.2 cast diaphragm.... This is from Antique Divers email to me about bench tests:
"Did a little more breathing with it at 140 IP and 1/8" free play in lever while under pressure. It consistently just begins to give air at 0.5 - 0.6 inches of water column as measured on my Magnehelic gauge, and doesn't go over 1.0" before dropping back down below 0.5" with heavier breathing. This is with a totally stock Trieste configuration other than the Diaphragm v 0.2, as I temporarily removed the adjustable venturi feature for testing.
Boosting the venturi by a little can make it perform even better, but may call for having to use a VDH mouthpiece with the baffle to prevent blowby out the exhaust."
Now for the bad news.... with the small friction plate (compared to the Dacors I've been doing) the "holderonner holes" became notches. Which allowed the plate to partially separate from the silicone during the course of a test dive. Not a catastrophic fail, but also not acceptable. Version 0.3 and 0.4 are hopefully being poured today, with the only changes being to address the friction plate retention.
Steady improvements... almost there.
Respectfully,
James
p.s. 2 piece band clamps are in the works as well!
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Post by surflung on Dec 30, 2021 10:37:23 GMT -8
Thanks for the update James and Bill. I'm excited about this new diaphragm AND the 2-piece band clamp!
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Post by james1979 on Dec 31, 2021 5:31:40 GMT -8
Well, Version 0.3 and 0.4 are out of the mold and look promising. The white disc is salvaged from a 0.0.1 (the too thin silicone back with full holder-onner holes, never made it past demolding). Looks promising (I'll probably keep it for my own use), the small holes effectively "stitch" the disc in place with silicone. Not super strong, but should hold up to all but intentional abuse. The pink disc is new, slightly closer spaced holder-onner holes and a central hole that worked out better than I expected. I think it's probably the winner, but I'm not sure the center hole is even necessary (except as a back up for if the outer holes tear through). It shouldn't interfere with the lever so I'll keep it there. I'm going to redo the discs with more holder onner holes, and keep the central fall back hole, and call it a version 1.0 (I'm an optimist). I haven't trimmed the casting flash off them yet, but rest assured I will! I won't officially call them good until Antique Diver gets them in hand and concurs (or tells me what to fix and I fix it!). On the band clamp, my first cut was sized wrong (I made a simple error, and didn't had never seen a Trieste in the flesh so didn't catch it from oviousness). And now I have a Trieste in hand, so that should progress a bit faster... hope to print one this weekend. Respectfully, James
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Post by antique diver on Dec 31, 2021 5:49:02 GMT -8
As James mentioned I dove with the newest version 0.2 on Tuesday. Couldn't get any of my lightweight diving friends to go due to 58 degree water, so went solo to get the testing done. It was a fairly warm day but the wind was creating a chop reducing visibility on my windward shore to 10', but that's not bad for Texas lakes. As expected the Trieste breathed smoothly and evenly even with heavy breathing. The bottom leveled off at 43', which was just as well since visibility had dropped to nearly nothing by 40'. As I cruised back up to more interesting terrain I began to notice a little "click" feeling at the beginning of each inhalation, and every few breaths there was a noticeable increase in effort so I stayed above 20' on the way back to exit place. I originally suspected that the duckbill eliminator may be causing some interference since I already knew was touching and tilting the diaphragm a bit on one side before diving. When I opened reg up I found that the center disc of diaphragm was separating from the silicone for about 180 degrees. I supposed the issue could have been initiated by the DBE contact with one side, but further exam revealed that the disc was easily dislodged from its retaining groove anyway. (I'll still going to replace the DBE with a normal duckbill since there just isn't enough room for it in the can) After explaining the issue to James he quickly came up with a potential cure and has already cast a new version of the diaphragm that should provide better retention of the disc. I look forward to another cool water dive for testing. Too bad some of you northern polar bear types aren't here to join in the trial dives. It has been a pleasure working with James on the evolution of the diaphragm, and I feel certain it will be soon be perfected. Having no one to take photos during the dive this is the best I could do with my phone held over my head before the dive with Trieste mounted on my inverted 27's. My 8 year old Hydroglove drysuit is holding up well and kept me comfortable for two 30 minute dives:
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Post by vance on Dec 31, 2021 8:52:36 GMT -8
I am trying another approach to fixing the loose disk problem in the v.01 diaphragms. Please forgive the technical jargon, but James's nomenclature has been established with his holder-onners, holder-inners, and fall-back holes. My approach is to skoosh some flowable silicone around and inside the holder-onner flaps, then skoosh some more on the inner side of the disk. I plopped the disk onto the diaphragm, and fiddly-squished the disk around and stretched the holder-onner flaps up and around the disk rim. It was then placed upside down on the custom Trieste diaphragm mold and a pusher-downer/weight system was devised. Everything was then placed on the silicone curing station to set. Note that the use of a Google internet streaming device is not strictly necessary (Apple devices and others will work, btw), but useful.
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Post by SeaRat on Dec 31, 2021 10:49:49 GMT -8
Antique Diver,
'Love the Hydro Glove dry suit. I'm curious, it looks like you are using a neck seal, with a wetsuit hood. How does that work in cold water? I'm considering a Aquala dry suit, and am curious about which style to look at.
John
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Post by vance on Dec 31, 2021 18:51:25 GMT -8
Flowable silicone doesn't stick to the printed disk very well, but my diaphragm should be ok if I refrain from abusing it beyond all bounds of decency.
Like if I install it and use it normally.
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