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Post by nikeajax on Jan 3, 2013 10:13:45 GMT -8
'Nother question... I know it's just marketing, but, what's comparable to Healthways? They always say in their catalogs that they're the best in their class: was there anything less expensive? They seem pretty optimistic about the Scuba Star; to quote their catalog:
"The Scuba Star is not limited to 'shallow water' or 'sport diving', it is professionally designed and engineered to be used comfortably to depths of 200 feet."
The Russians have a military saying, "Adequate is good enough..." These old regs are brutal and dependable, but nothing fancy which is why I'm so fascinated with them.
Just curious, Jaybird
PS I think one of these days my wife is going to tell me, "That John is a bad influence on you, how much Heathways gear do you need!" ;D SNORT!
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 3, 2013 18:20:34 GMT -8
Okay John, I bought that reg you pointed out to me... thanks! Playing with the idea of taking an impression of the diaphragm, for a mold...
So, what's the difference between a "Scubair-300" and a "Scuba Sonic"? Name only?
Jaybird
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Post by sharkskin on Jan 3, 2013 19:54:04 GMT -8
As always John, very impressive material! Thanks so much. How did you find this NAVY archives?? Wao!
I have several Conshelf regulators... all great breathers.. and very elegant... especially the Calypso models from late 60's, but like I said, recently I got interested in the Healthways single hoses.
Thanks again John.
Harry.
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 3, 2013 22:10:41 GMT -8
Jaybird, 'glad you got that reg; I think you'll enjoy that diaphragm. I put one like it onto my Scuba Star, the tilt valve, and it breathed quite well. Harry, I found the Rubicon Foundation site when I went to Wikipedia and looked up the U.S. Navy Experimental Diving Unit a few years back. In their references they had links to the Rubicon Foundation's reports. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Navy_Experimental_Diving_UnitIf you follow the first link to a report called "Pioneering Inner Space, The Navy Experimental Diving Unit's First 50 Years," you get this link: archive.rubicon-foundation.org/xmlui/handle/123456789/4799From there, it was simply a matter of doing some searches on the site. If you type simply "regulator" into the Rubicon Foundation's website, you get 338 results, which are very, very interesting to a vintage scuba guy like me. John
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 4, 2013 19:12:17 GMT -8
I have looked more closely at the 1975 NEDU evaluation of the Scubair II and the Scubair 300, and found some interesting things. The exhalation resistance is said to meet the U.S. Navy requirements, but is slightly outside their line on the graph. But it is the inhalation requirements that I found very interesting.
Apparently, they used both the Scubair II and the Scubair 300 at minimal psig (200 psig) for part of the evaluation. They apparently also had the Scubair II set for the restrictor orifice setting, which is why they got very high inhalation resistance at 200 psig. This restrictor orifice is designed to make breathing difficult at depth, and force the diver to ascend to get better breathing characteristics from the regulator. The same is true for the Scubair 300, which employes a "sonic reserve." Because the sonic reserve affects the air delivery, the breathing resistance is going to increase as the sonic reserve in activated. This occurs by design[/B] to ensure that the diver knows that his/her air supply is getting low. The air is routed through the sonic reserve mechanism at about 500 psig and below, instead of around it as happens at higher pressures. This allows the sonic cylinder to activate, and the "thumps" are heard when inhaling.
The NEDU makes some assumptions, and they don't like a regulator which restricts air flow to the diver. If they had tested the Scubair II on the J-valve setting, which bypasses the automatic reserve orifice, I think it would have rated better. The Scubair 300, with the sonic reserve, will still restrict the air flow, but again this is by design.
I just found out that the downstream seat can be removed and flipped over in the Healthways second stages (not the tilt valve ones though). That makes it easier to repair in the field too.
John
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 5, 2013 10:46:37 GMT -8
Okay, not really sure how to read that dang graph: is it the closer to ZERO the better? Thought it was interesting that they tested the USD stuff at the USD facility: hmmmmmm? I also noticed the Aquarius passed too. Did the Calypso-II pass USN standards, yeah, I know they only show the C-III, and that ilk...
Jaybird
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 5, 2013 22:34:18 GMT -8
Jaybird, the graphs are easier to read if they are printed out. The center line is the "zero" effort for breathing. Across the center is the depth at which the breathing resistance is measured. Above the center line is inhalation resistance, while below is exhalation resistance. The dotted line is the U.S. Navy standard (MIL_R-24169A) for breathing resistance (which is no longer valid--it has been updated). The lines with a circle are at 1400 psig supply air, and the lines with a triangle are at 200 psig. Exhalation resistance is the same for both 200 and 1400 psig, as that parameter is independent of supply pressure. For the Scubair II, the inhalation resistance goes off the chart at 200 psig, which it should especially as you go deeper as the calibrated orifice is designed to make breathing more difficult at lower psi and at depth, forcing the diver to surface to get more air. The same is apparently true of the sonic reserve of the Scubair 300. The thing to remember is that the closer to zero, the better.
The Calypso II was never tested, from what I can tell. It wasn't until USD enlarged the exhaust ports for their second stages that they passed, and then all their regulators passed. Scubapro had the same problem as the Scubair, as when tested the NEDU tested the adjustable second stage at both the full-out position, and the full-in position. Of course, it failed the test at the full-in position, just as that was designed to do. The reason for the adjustment was that in high current situations, with the stiffer spring resistance (and subsequent harder breathing) the water current could not push against the diaphragm and cause air leakage--this was requested by the cave divers who needed to conserve air in heavy current in fresh water caverns.
John
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 7, 2013 18:27:39 GMT -8
Jaybird, I don't have anything saying the original Calypso regulator was tested by the NEDU, but i do now have proof it was used by Navy divers on SEALAB II. www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFBDs6yTkgMJohn Attachments:
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 8, 2013 9:14:36 GMT -8
Very cool. Just as I started watching it, I was thinking to myself, "Hmmm, Scott Carpenter was part of that work..." an' guess who shows up gettin' himself stung by a fish an' singin' "Good Night Irene" like some kinda cartoon bug?
I've read a lot about the Project Mercury Program: apparently he really screwed up when he went up, maneuvering way too much, burning up lots of fuel, to take pictures. This got the brass super PO'ed, "Yer done son..." Evidently it was his wife that pushed him to be an astronaut, he wasn't that interested in it.
Are some of those re-breathers they're using, or are they BC's? Didn't some of those guys use Scubapro gear which was, at the time, exactly the same as Healthways, and didn't some of that gear fail?
Jaybird
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 8, 2013 11:27:14 GMT -8
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 8, 2013 17:40:17 GMT -8
Jaybird, while the design is essentially the same, there are cosmetic differences, such as the wrench grip on the Scuba Star that is not present on the cap of the Scubapro Mk 2. Concerning Scott Carpenter, he is the only Mercury astronaut who was recovered by USAF Pararescue. Here are two videos of the flight and recovery of the Aurora 7 Mercury capsule: www.youtube.com/watch?v=glJPObUe9D8www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixvamIbqa6EHere is a history from NASA of Scott Carpenter: history.nasa.gov/40thmerc7/carpenter.htmI have a book titled Pararescue, 50 Years[/B] which has this to say of the flight: I served with John Heitsch (by then a Tech Sargent) in Okinawa and Korea in 1968. He never did mention that he had been one of the PJs to recover Aurora 7. John
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 8, 2013 18:11:04 GMT -8
Yeah, that 250-mile difference was because he used up all his fuel snappin' pix. Being a Navy boy, he musta been embarrassed to have you lads pick his sorry behind out of the drink, then get really chewed out once he was on dry land--OOPS! I'll have to share this story with my wife, she and I are pretty geeky 'bout Projects Mercury and Gemini: our favorite astronaut is Gus Grissom, another USAF guy Jaybird
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Post by SeaRat on Jan 8, 2013 18:54:29 GMT -8
Jaybird, I put more info on the Diving Media page under SEALAB II about how Scott Carpenter was rescued. I figured we were getting a bit away from the discussion of Healthways regulators here. If you'll read the entire story of Carpenter's flight, this was only the second manned space flight for the USA which orbited. He was tasked with way too much to do, so part of the problems were with the amount of things he was to do. Also, some of the "automatic" features such as the retro burn he had do do manually, and when he did that three seconds later it placed him further down-range. I think he actually did a commendable job with the spacecraft, and got down safely. As they say, a successful flight is one you walk away from. Yes, he had people worried, and yes, there was inter-service rivalry. Read the posts under Diving Media, and you'll see that we could have landed an SA-16 Flying Boat and picked him up about an hour earlier than the helicopters. But then he would have been flown to shore, and not to a Navy ship! Concerning Gus Grissom, he lost his Mercury spacecraft, and it was on the bottom of the Atlantic for about 38 years. I believe it was recently found, and photographed on the bottom, and it has been recovered now. But he probably did a greater mess-up than Carpenter when he lost the Liberty Bell after a hatch "inadvertently" blew when he was getting out. He stayed in the program, and later died in Apollo I. www.science20.com/science_20/gus_grissom_and_liberty_bell_7_50_years_ago_today-81075www.evergreenexhibitions.com/exhibits/lost_spacecraft/index.aspwww.youtube.com/watch?v=LD0M4Op5_Q8Now, getting back to Healthways regulators, I have about 8 combinations of Healthways single and double hose regulators ready to dive, and no place to go to dive. I was going to get them in the water in the pool last weekend, but they had a water polo tournament scheduled, and cancelled the scuba opening. Maybe this weekend I got finally get them into the water; open water is currently out, as the rivers are now again high and mucky. John
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 9, 2013 13:56:15 GMT -8
Are Water-Dogs collectable? Found a pair, broken straps, at the thrift store, kinda olive green now, usetawas aqua-blue onstaponnatime... Guess I can use 'em as a prop for my paintings...
Jaybird
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Post by nikeajax on Jan 9, 2013 14:43:21 GMT -8
Got the Scubair-300 today... To quote the kid from "A Christmas Story", "Oooooh fffffffuuuuuuudge!" Same nasty old diaphragm--GRRRRRR! www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgx1sSfriIALots of salt damage too--SIGH! Jaybird
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