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Post by luis on Oct 24, 2005 8:56:39 GMT -8
The drawings below are preliminary. I am looking for comments and suggestions. It would also be helpful if someone can double check the original nozzle dimensions. This is a similar post as the one in Bryan’s web site. The first drawing is of the 1st stage HP nozzle for a Royal Aqua Master. I measured as closely as I could to have a starting reference. I am planning on cutting an already trashed nozzle to get better details of the cavity below the volcano orifice. I believe there is a washer pressed in, to form that cavity. The new nozzle can be used as an upgrade to any Aqua Master or Royal Aqua Master. The performance should be identical to an existing Royal. The only improvements are the addition of a HP port, a replaceable volcano orifice, and the use of a Conshelf threaded yoke (3000 - 4000 PSI). All the internal parts would be from the Conshelf, including the push pin in the same length as the Conshelf. The reason for three HP ports is because with a threaded unit it is impossible to predict the precise final orientation of the port for every regulator. I decided to stay with the 3/8”-24tpi to keep the height to a minimum. All the ports need to be marked "HP". There is always the danger of someone attaching an LP hose to this HP ports. I may still be able to reduce the size a bit, but it is driven by the port size and the Conshelf yoke. At this point it is 0.61 inches taller than the original yoke. This should work OK with most backpacks. It would actually place the regulator closer to your back. My main reason for this unit is for all the DA Aqua Master out there which will eventually have no usable 1st stage seats. Conshelf 1st stage parts will be around for a long time. They are also used on the Legend and for all I know in most new Aqua Lung regulators. There are also other advantages with a balanced 1st stage (better performance and the ability to be used with higher pressure tanks). A replaceable volcano orifice and HP ports are nice upgrades.
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 24, 2005 10:52:00 GMT -8
Yes, the Titan at least still uses the Conshelf internals. When do you think you might start producing these?
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Post by luis on Oct 24, 2005 12:29:36 GMT -8
At this point I am at the point were I am getting a quote for a prototype.
Actual fabrication and testing the prototype I hope during the next couple of month.
This is a winter project. I am hoping they will be available by early spring.
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Post by SeaRat on Oct 25, 2005 9:03:28 GMT -8
Luis,
I see that you have a larger main opening, 0.139 verses 0.120 inches in the original nozzle. This would increase the performance at depth. It would be a very nice addition for my DA Aquamaster. Keep us informed...
John
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Post by luis on Oct 25, 2005 10:28:05 GMT -8
Hi John
The volcano orifice in my nozzle is from the later Conshelf (USD part number 106027). It is a replaceable part and it doesn’t cost very much (probably a lot less than having it machined into the body). I think this is a great feature, but I am afraid the orifice inside diameter is the same size as the original. I actually haven’t had a need to measure it, since it is a direct replacement. It works with the same seat.
The 0.139” ID dimension is for the pin holder guide. I think that dimension is staying the same.
A new dimension is the 0.188” ID. This orifice provides a shelf for the replaceable volcano orifice to sit on. The reason for the large size is to minimize flow resistance.
I am hoping and expecting that the first stage performance is just as good as the present Royal. It would be difficult to make it better. With both of my Royals, I can suck as hard as I can and the intermediate pressure never varies more that 5 to 7 psi. I have them set to around 145 psi.
I have been looking for a submersible IP gauge to test the intermediate pressure at depth but haven’t located one.
My suspicion is that the performance of the 1st stage doesn’t change with depth. Since most of the workings in the 1st stage are operating at either tank pressure or 10 atm (147 psi above ambient pressure). I don’t think that the addition of a few atmospheres to the IP makes much of a difference to the 1st stage performance. My guess is that the over all performance at depth (of any well design regulator) is mostly affected by the second stage. This should be ease to confirm with a submersible IP gauge (if I could find one).
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Post by Captain on Oct 25, 2005 17:35:51 GMT -8
Why do you need a submersible gauge? Any gauge would work just for testing. Besides if the gauge was waterproof it wouldn't be subjected to ambient pressure and it would give you an incorrect indication of pressure above ambient.
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 25, 2005 18:32:48 GMT -8
Why do you need a submersible gauge? Any gauge would work just for testing. Besides if the gauge was waterproof it wouldn't be subjected to ambient pressure and it would give you an incorrect indication of pressure above ambient. He is talking about measuring the intermediate pressure, not the tank pressure.
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Post by Captain on Oct 25, 2005 20:11:13 GMT -8
I know, that's why he needs a guage exposed to ambient pressure because the IP is the pressure above ambient. If the gauge is sealed than it remains at atmospheric pressure and it would indicate the difference between the IP and atmospheric and not between IP and ambient.
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Post by luis on Oct 26, 2005 2:56:49 GMT -8
I could use either type of gauge. Whether it measures differential pressure (referenced to ambient) or gauge pressure (pressure referenced to one atmosphere). You can convert between either type of reading.
The advantage of a sealed gauge is that it would not corrode. I guess I could use an inexpensive gauge (and assume it is semi-disposable). I probably would want to drill some holes in the case to allow water to flow freely. That way I could try to rinse it.
It needs to last several dives (not all necessarily in the same week) so that I can compare several regulators (modified and original design: Royal and DA).
I dive mostly in salt water, but even the water in the one deep (75 ft) quarry I have sometimes access to, would require rinsing the gauge after using it.
I may try an inexpensive gauge and don’t worry about ruining it. Worst case is that I may waist $20 on a gauge.
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Post by RMannix on Oct 26, 2005 6:10:31 GMT -8
I picked up a nice little IP gauge on eBay a while back for about $15, plugs into a standard BC inflator hose and looks as waterproof as any SPG. I'll see if I can find one there later
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Creed
Pro Diver
Posts: 189
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Post by Creed on Oct 26, 2005 6:49:48 GMT -8
I picked up a nice little IP gauge on eBay a while back for about $15, plugs into a standard BC inflator hose and looks as waterproof as any SPG. I'll see if I can find one there later I bought a cheap tire inflator with a BC quick disconnect, took off the disconnect and attached it to a cheap 300psi gauge from the local hardware store. It came in a few bucks under the price of a new one. But, in luis' case, he could build one, and if the guage was damaged, swap it out for a new cheap guage.
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Post by Billy on Oct 26, 2005 8:17:06 GMT -8
Tractor Supply has cheap 180 psi (more accurate than the 300 psi) guages.........I use the 180 on my regs. for IP adjustments, it shows 5 psi difference from the 300 psi guage. Best part, they're cheap..........drilling holes will work for rinsing........steel has about 90 days longivity in salt water........keep the guage in a bottle of fresh water after each dive to keep the salt from depositing....should last you for six months or so like that......used that trick on a old burbon tube depth guage years ago....it lasted for three years.
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Post by RMannix on Oct 26, 2005 10:47:26 GMT -8
I picked up a nice little IP gauge on eBay a while back for about $15, plugs into a standard BC inflator hose and looks as waterproof as any SPG. I'll see if I can find one there later Here's the one I have, $14.99: ebay item number 7192358040
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Post by luis on Oct 26, 2005 11:51:04 GMT -8
Hi Rick That gauge looks like the one from Dive Rite: www.diveriteexpress.com/regs/ipg.shtmlIt looks very waterproof (and it is only $22 with the QD fitting), but I called Dive Rite and they told me it wasn’t. Billy: could you post a link to were I can find that cheap 180 psi gauge? Peter Built has a nice gauge with quick disconnect adapter for $21. The gauge by itself is $18. www.scubatools.com/Gauge.htmlIt is a 300 psi gauge, but it has the standard IP range highlighted, which makes it easier to read. Thanks for every ones suggestions.
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Post by william bonney on Oct 26, 2005 19:00:49 GMT -8
Luis
Tractor Supply doesn't list everything they carry in a store on their web site.......sorry, just finished looking. They are a farm hardware store, and if your not close to the edge of the city where you live, there might not be one close by. However, you should be able to find this guage at any Lowes or Homedepot also, or maybe your local hardware store. Look in the compressor & welding sections. Vilor is one of the manufactures. It is not for oxygen service.
The one I have has female intake and male exhaust 1/2 fittings and a on/off valve. I put a reducer to 1/8 barb on the male fitting, the barb is into a old lp reg. hose. All this is on the opposite end of the flow for what it is set up for. That way I can release the pressure on the guage after turning the tank valve off. The whole affair cost me less than $12.00
Billy
Good luck.
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